There are some things that are not true here.<br>True is, that x86 is on the bottom of popularity, because of the disadvantages.<br>Also it's true, that linux runs on x86. Linux's also running on SPARC - but nobody would use SPARC in a phone, so that is simply no reason for using x86.
<br>But it is not true, that skype only runs on x86. There is skype for Win Mobile devices [1] (I haven't ever seen a win mobile device using x86) which mainly are ARM/XScale based. Skype is also working on getting their software running on Symbian (Series60) - a platform only used on ARM.
<br><br>It is also false that flash/shockwave only runs on x86. My Nokia 7710 (ARM9 based) has opera mobile with flash-plugin and it works perfectly.<br>The Nokia 770/N800 - also ARM based - has a flash-player as well.<br>
<br>So I still see no reason for having a energy comsuming x86-monster in my phone. :)<br><br>[1] <a href="http://www.skype.com/intl/en/download/skype/mobile/">http://www.skype.com/intl/en/download/skype/mobile/</a><br><br>
<div><span class="gmail_quote">2007/6/10, Matthew S. Hamrick <<a href="mailto:mhamrick@cryptonomicon.net">mhamrick@cryptonomicon.net</a>>:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
Before we run off and predict that the sky is falling, let's consider<br>a couple of things:<br><br>1. This is a prototype. This is not a product. This is a system that<br>demonstrates how small you can make a device with the new C7-S
<br>processors. Also... take a look at how many discrete components are<br>on the board. Now open up any of your mobile electronics and compare.<br>It's doesn't completely destroy your BOM cost to have these<br>components, but it does add a bit of manufacturing cost. Adding $12
<br>to the cost of the phone is pretty much a deal-killer for "mobile<br>phones," but not for "smart phones" and "mobile terminals."<br><br>2. No. the only reason for an x86 cell phone is not to run windows.
<br>ARM is very popular for WinCE devices. Less popular is MIPS. And<br>somewhere at the bottom of the popularity scale is x86. But... it is<br>there. There's also an operating system called Linux that's been<br>known to run on x86 devices. And... if you were wanting to build a
<br>mobile phone with the Skype libraries installed, right now, your only<br>option is x86.<br><br>3. CDMA. I agree, it is odd that CDMA would be their first choice.<br>Perhaps they were working closely with a customer that had a specific
<br>requirement for CDMA, or maybe they engineer they tasked with the job<br>of building this thing was more familiar with CDMA. But the major<br>manufacturers like Nokia, Sony-Ericsson, etc. all make both GSM and<br>CDMA versions of their phones. I sorta got used to companies
<br>releasing GSM phones first, as there's a larger market. But CDMA is<br>definitely an important player in China, South Korea and the US.<br><br>So my guess is... somewhere out there in China is a group that wants<br>
to make a CDMA2000 phone for sale in the domestic market. They're<br>trying to build a smart-phone or a "mobile terminal" like the<br>blackberry or Treo. Market penetration of Linux phones in China is<br>much better than it is here in the states or Europe. So maybe they're
<br>interested in using an x86-only library on a mobile device. My guess<br>is Skype. Furthermore, my guess is they approached Via with the idea<br>of using one of their processors. Via referred them to Epia who began<br>
designing a demo board. The deal fell through and now Via needs to<br>find an application for these processors, so publicizing this<br>prototype is a way of getting people to think about x86 embedded.<br><br>IMHO, the only reason you would want to have an x86 based processor
<br>like the C7-S (which is still an order of magnitude worse in power<br>consumption than ARM processors) is to run x86 specific code. So<br>yeah... that could be XP/embedded, but it could also be some x86<br>specific Linux library.
<br><br>Just my $0.02.<br><br>-Cheers<br>-Matt H.<br><br><br>On Jun 10, 2007, at 12:16 PM, Robin Paulson wrote:<br><br>>> When you look at the board you see that there is not much space left.<br>>> It seems there's no GSM, no WiFi, no other chip already.
<br>><br>> i've heard talk elsewhere of a built in cdma module. that's an odd<br>> choice considering the number of operators switching to gsm, but i<br>> would assume via will change/add to this down the track
<br>><br>>> And as I always say: The only reason for using x86 in small and<br>>> embedded<br>>> devices is running Windows.<br>>> I really don't want to have Windows on my phone. No CE/Mobile,
<br>>> exceptionally<br>>> no XP/Vista. Do you? :)<br>><br>> hell no, i ditched win long since. but some people will<br>> and there are a number of closed pieces of software only available for<br>> x86. flash is one of them, shockwave another. maybe skype, i'm not
<br>> sure what that runs on<br>> add in things like a half decent fpu (compared to arm anyway) and the<br>> platform starts to approach desktop functionality for all sorts of<br>> applications. as the oqo has partly shown, there's no reason a mobile
<br>> (pc/phone) can't be a desktop as well with the addition of a proper<br>> qwerty kb and monitor when the user gets to the office<br>><br>> this is an awesome development, i'm in 2 minds myself whether to buy a
<br>> pico itx or wait for this next year<br>><br>> _______________________________________________<br>> OpenMoko community mailing list<br>> <a href="mailto:community@lists.openmoko.org">community@lists.openmoko.org
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