Just a personal feedback - I'm just writing for me Re: And please use a emailclients with working "Reference" Re: gmail users CC'ing

[Robert Michel]

Salve Marcel,*!

This is a personal answer from me - I'm very sorry to started
this thread going into deep and I do not want to harm Openmoko
by dissmotivating people to join...

So, my style was not ok and I already asked for excuse me.


On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Marcel de Jong wrote:

> Sorry for not replying at the bottom...
> 
> Why the open hostility towards GMail users?
> 
> You all tout "we want freedom to choose" and all that, but still you'd
> like to stifle the same level of freedom of others.
> 
> I choose to use GMail, that's a deliberate choice, because it's one of
> the few great _webmail_ applications, with which I can access my mail
> anywhere I want. (I'm not always at home reading my mail)
> 
> I've tried Yahoo mail, didn't like it, I even tried Fastmail in the
> past. (which was slow)
> 
> Gmail is responsive for me, and has a lot of good features that I like
> and that I use.
> And so far I have yet to see any proof of Google actively scr*wing
> over their customers, by violating their privacy. Yes they add ads on
> the side of the page by scanning your email, 

Yes, google is scanning *my* email and selling adds fitting to
the mail - maybe also selling informations about me to others...

You as gmail user has agreed that google is allowed to 
- scan *my* email
- to save *my* email as long as google likes.

I do not have a problem with this, as long it is only about
emails going to a public mailinglist - but when I want to
send a personal mail to that person the problems starts.

> like they also do with
> the ad-sense ads, there is no difference there, no human eyes are
> involved in that process. I have seen no proof of datamining,

http://www.epic.org/privacy/gmail/faq.html

Comparing with the spirit of the BBS times (with modems) 
a lot of interest of self-determined communication has
been lost, people using skype and gmail because it is
free - not caring what the price is that the have to 
pay or the people they are communicate with.

I can't understand why people so close-fisted not spending 
some US$/Euros a year for a mailservice without advertisement
and data mining. When more users would do this, better
services would be on the market.


And just agreed to Richards point:
>> Why so many people who believe in the ideals put forward by the
>> Neo/Openmoko project are happy to use Gmail astounds me..

> If you can't deal with gmail-messages, fine, block all gmail.com

My sound was wrong - I just want make you think that you
are give away you and others privatcy for a free webmailservice.

And when the webmailer is also reason for trouble....


I hope my comments against gmail does only cost
*me* sympathy points and *not* *OpenMoko*
and I also hope that even when my sound was wrong,
it creates reflection about decentral self controlled
services instead of big-players data-mining solutions.

OpenMoko has a big chance for *more* privatcy but
- because it is for free
- because everybody else is using it 
- becaus yzx is the biggest on the market
is narrow minded and will not be a good adviser 
to reach more privacy.

/rob