Crowdfunding an Ubuntu smartphone (right now)

[Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller]

Am 05.10.2013 um 20:10 schrieb Martin Jansa:

> On Sat, Oct 05, 2013 at 05:37:59PM +0000, Bob Ham wrote:
>> On Sat, 2013-10-05 at 17:17 +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
>>> Am 05.10.2013 um 12:12 schrieb Bob Ham:
>>> 
>>>> On Sat, 2013-10-05 at 07:50 +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Neither the Openmoko, OpenPandora, Ubuntu Edge, GTA04 are
>>>>> "open hardware" - and never were intended to be.
>>>> 
>>>> That isn't what your OpenPhoenux page says:
>> 
>>>> You're also contradicting your own previous statements:
>> 
>>>> This admission makes your announcement here seem deceitful:
>> 
>>> Hm, I wonder what you want to prove?
>> 
>> I want you to stop describing the GTA04 as open hardware.  You seem to
>> be aware that there is a difference between what you describe as "open
>> hardware" and what others describe as "open hardware" and yet you ignore
>> this discrepancy and continue as if what you're saying is true because
>> it accords with your own personal definition.
> 
> I'm sorry but I think you're doing the same, just from the other side.
> 
> From this thread it's clear that different people understand "open
> hardware" differently, but that doesn't mean that they are wrong or
> dishonest.
> 
> "open hardware" isn't AFAIK any registered "sticker" or "trade mark"
> with clearly defined meaning, so it's pity that different people
> associate it with different meanings/freedoms, but that's not their
> fault.

++

> Your "source code" citations from licenses are nice, but license text is
> the right place where you should find definition of what's meant by term
> "source code", OpenPhoenux page doesn't say that it's using terminilogy
> from ohanda or oshwa.

++

and not from GPL or BSD or MIT licenses etc.

We use CC and it defines:

"THE WORK (AS DEFINED BELOW) IS PROVIDED UNDER THE TERMS OF THIS CREATIVE COMMONS PUBLIC LICENSE ("CCPL" OR "LICENSE")."

"Work" means the literary and/or artistic work offered under the terms of this License including without limitation any production in the literary, scientific and artistic domain, whatever may be the mode or form of its expression including digital form, such as a book, pamphlet and other writing; a lecture, address, sermon or other work of the same nature; a dramatic or dramatico-musical work; ..."

I.e. paper is explicitly included and all forms of its expression.

> "open hardware" is imho closest term you can use to describe advantage
> of gta04 for other people asking why you don't use cheaper android phone
> or why they should buy gta04.

or even more closed buy an iPhone or Lumia...

> Using "open-hardware-but-without-CAD-files" is maybe less misleading for
> people who has great understanding of all free/open definitions used in
> the world (and wikipedia), but also more misleading for "normal" people.
> 
> Your accusations sounds like if Nikolaus is using OHANDA clearly defined
> label without fulfilling requirements defined by OHANDA.

++

this confirms my own answer (was written before reading yours).

Tnx -- hns